For the context of the following comments and to reply, please click on the DATE/TIME above them.
Psychedelics – “Not recognized by the Nicean councils..there were two“
Little Bear – “Not all recognize Truth. Some only recognize the authority of Nicean councils.“
Psychedelics – “Everyone has their own truths .. meditation and prayer will lead us.“
Everyone has their own working hypotheses. Until, in the eternity of One, all approximations dissolve.
Any distinctions of this-and-that, of me-and-other, means that the fool still reigns.
MADNESS – “There is only one truth. The rest are merely smoke and mirrors“
Where is the one True truth? Where is it not?
Faith Reasoner responding to Dr. Stephen Falken – “Only fools treat science and religion as enemies. Science simply shows the way God rules the universe at present. Religion teaches us how to value things, how to value people, how to be morally constructive, how to be in moral harmony with our creator.“
B Mc responding to Faith Reasoner – “ ‘Only fools treat science and religion as enemies’….. They are Enemies if those In Religion Insist on Magic Tricks and as an Explanation for the Universes Mysteries….“
We are all fools, each in our own way. Imposing science on religious myth being no exception.
Inappropriate rule mongering by any other name smells as rank.
Jero Jones responding to Faith Reasoner – “You do not need to be Christian or religious to be morally correct, or to be a good person, people have been good without god since time immemorial. Science shows those with knowledge the utter futility of superstitious deities, and the immorality, and deception within religion.“
What is “time”? What is “good”? What are “people”?
A knowledgeable understanding of God, shows the utter futility of the premise “without god”. Though, “without an idea of God”, might have been a plausible substitute.
Religion is optional yes, but your generalizations point more to a collection of biases, hardly discernible from “superstition”.
Jero Jones – “I am not concerned with your semantics, my point was to show that man (or woman) do not need a god/deity/supernatural being or anything else to be good. A belief in a divine being that makes you “good and morally” superior over others, is a religious fallacy.“
It was clear what you were saying. It was also clear that you are talking about cartoon versions of God, religion and probably science.
Cultivation of “good” comes by raising the level of play. Just tipping over the board proves what?
You summarized by saying:
“A belief in a divine being that makes you “good and morally” superior over others, is a religious fallacy.”
The better arguments I’ve been seeing here, stress that belief in God provides motivation and guidance. Life is lived with the purpose of cultivating a goodness that goes beyond mere perpetuation of DNA.
Your ears seem deaf to this nuance.
Pleasenoreligion responding to Jero Jones – “I agree. Treating those in your community with kindness or empathy is in line with an animal /scientific instinct to survive in your community or clan or however you want to put it. People in a community that are theives, murderers and wife stealers would quic[k]ly become outcast and kicked out of the group, where the perpetrator would find it difficult to survive on their own. It’s the same thing that gives teenagers the immense drive to not be the outcast.
Alot of mammals that live in social groups display what we might see as altruistic behavior when all it is, is survival.“
Avoiding religious terminology minimizes the risk of standing out in certain circles.
But what, or who “survives”?
Same questions arise and get ignored in different ways.
Pleasenoreligion – “Who or what survives? I thought I made a clear, concise statement but I will try to help you understand in an even simpler way. Any living creature that survives by following social rules: wolves, monkeys, meerkats…and the most intelligent mammal – humans. Religion’s rules that require one to be altruistic is just a set of rules to ensure your survival and possible flourishing of your life. That’s all religion is about and the christian 10 commandments. (and please don’t get it in your head that I’m of another religion – attacking christianity as all religions have the same basic rules). Someone who doesn’t follow the basic ‘rules’ will become an outcast in society, and for one to flouish in life, they need connections, networking if you will, and people who give themselves a bad rep will be shunned to the outer edge of society. For example, who’s going to lend their name to a theif to get that person a good job. Or if that theif is down on his luck, would someone shelter the theif? No.
The main reason for the basic rules of any religion is to ensure one’s survival and flourishing.
It’s the same with social animals. If a female meerkat is promiscuous and breeds, it is kicked out of the clan and forced to raise the pups on their own, which isn’t a promising situation because meerkat pups need babysitting while the parent is off finding food. Only the dominant female is allowed to breed.
I hope I have cleared up any confusion for you.“
“Religion’s rules that require one to be altruistic is just a set of rules to ensure your survival and possible flourishing of your life. That’s all religion is about … ”
Yea, if exclusively looking through a microscope could actually provide a realistic perspective.
A few more laps around the block and the question of un-caused causation arises. The Real becomes interesting. Then the question; How to clear away the litter of theories and dogma once their job is done?
The beacon of Experience. The nature of Existence. Who are We?